Q & A with Writer Josh Ozersky

If there's one thing Josh Ozersky doesn't do, it's mince words. As a Time food columnist and author, he's sparked debates about everything from eating horse meat to chain restaurants and diners' rights. But whether you agree with Josh on any given subject or not, it's hard to deny his passion for food or his highly entertaining writing style. 

But Josh, also known as "Mr. Cutlets," managed to surprise us with his strikingly candid answers during a recent interview.  What first inspired his fascination with food?   "Even from my earliest boyhood, I was obsessed with food, which mitigated my loneliness, succored my depression and filled the long hours of boredom," he explains.  "I could kill an hour just deciding what topping I would have on my pizza..."

Ironically, Josh recently married a woman who he says, "hardly eats at all.  She makes me take the skin off her chicken."  Speaking of which, he's over the mediocre fried chicken trend and happens to think KFC is the best,   though he does have a book coming out, called "Colonel Sanders and The American Dream." As for his dreams for the future, a TV show of his own and Meatopia events around the world.

Single/married/divorced?
Divorced, then single, now married.

Once upon the time, you were quite the bachelor, loyal only to food. What inspired you to give up your single ways?  Is she a good eater?
My single ways had little to hold me, offering as they did mostly solitude and celibacy. I was an inept, though ardent, womanizer, and my late-night trysts were generally with sandwiches. That said, I did like playing poker at the Genoa club, running after fast women, drinking far into the night, and playing video games. [My wife] Danit is not a very good eater. She hardly eats at all, in fact, and she doesn't like Chinese food. She makes me take the skin off her chicken. But I love her anyway and she has made me the happiest I've ever been.

What did you want to be when you grew up?
A writer / pundit / professional smart person, like our family friend Neil Postman. He was my role model.

How did your father, a painter and a stagehand, inspire and influence your passion for food?
It's funny you ask that; I'm working on a piece for Saveur about him. My father was a neurotic who was almost completely unable to talk about anything other than movies and food. I know we talked about other things, but honestly I can't really remember when. He was fascinated by chefs and restaurants and did a series of paintings of them. He was often sad, but food raised his spirits and that lesson was not wasted on me.

More specifically, what inspired your carnivorous dining habits?  Was there a defining bite, meal or burger?
There were many. One that comes to mind was a hamburger I had the morning after my mother's unexpected death. It was the first of many hamburger-shaped mood elevators I would take over the years.  But even from my earliest boyhood, I was obsessed with food, which mitigated my loneliness, succored my depression and filled the long hours of boredom. I could kill an hour just deciding what topping I would have on my pizza, on the off-chance I could talk my parents into ordering one.

If you had to pick between pork or beef, which would you choose (and yes, you have to choose)?
It's a good question. Beef is the noblest, most delicious, and most fortifying of all meats; but that said, I would choose pork, for the following reasons: One, because the fat of pork, fragrant and delicious, is a universal perfume and solvent, which can impart an ineffable mouthfeel and peerless to taste to any food lucky enough to bathe in it; Two, because pigs, adventurous and mirthful, are a superior animal to their dull-witted, sedate bovine cousins; Three, because beef jerky is not as good as ham, and bacon doesn't come from steers; Four, because there are something like nine different food groups found in the pig, including ribs, bacon, salumi, guanciale, pigs ears, pulled shoulders, crown roasts, pernil, braised pork belly, and sausages; Five, when you eat a steak or a short rib you are generally satisfied, but after a pork chop or hamsteak you generally want another one. On the other hand, without beef there are no hamburgers. So maybe it is beef, after all.

What was it like growing up in Atlantic City and what were some of your favorite restaurants there that are still around?  When was the last time you went back to Atlantic City?
I go back a few times a year. Growing up in Atlantic City was a strange and formative experience; I would direct the reader to my piece on the subject I wrote a few years ago; it can be found in The Best Food Writing 2009. I think. My favorite Atlantic City restaurant is certainly Tony's Baltimore Grill, a tiny bar where they served pan pizzas with big, chunky globs of bulk Italian butcher sausage made a few blocks away, and big open roast beef sandwiches on white bread. I am also a great admirer of Fornoletto, Steve Kalt's wonderful Italian restaurant at the Borgata. I want to see what Marc Forgione's steakhouse is like too.

What were the state of food blogs when you first started at Grub Street in 2006 and did you ever expect them to play such a prominent part of the restaurant and media industries?   
Honestly, Eater had already redefined the food media even before I started Grub Street for New York. But Grub Street brought New York's authority to food bloggery, and for a stretch there we seemed to have total hegemony over the news, including the print media. (This was before the Times started Diner's Journal to avoid being scooped by Eater and Grub Street.) I had been involved in the web for many years, having written for Suck.com, Feed, Business 2.0 and so on, so I knew that the second the food media encountered the Internet it was over. But I was surprised at the hunger for constant news that came. I thought it would be more like the kind of essayistic, evergreen stuff I had written at Slashfood, and which you still see a lot of at Serious Eats.

You've worked everywhere from to New York Magazine to CitySearch to Time Magazine and Esquire. What is (or was) your favorite gig?
I have a soft spot for the Feedbag, which is what Grub Street would have been like if I had had total control over it. On the other hand, I have never had quite the same juice as when I was writing Grub Street. I think my favorite gig is right now, writing a weekly column on food and culture for Time, and being read by a very wide non-foodie audience. I also like not having vile, malevolent trolls attack me six times a day. I'm very proud of the work I've done for Rachael Ray.com and Ehow too. But The Feedbag was a special time. It helps that I'm happily married now, and not writhing with unrequited love.

Do you think food writing has evolved or devolved over the last five years?
I'm a big believer in what historians sometimes call the Whig Theory of History, which basically amounts to everything getting better and better every year. Food writing has evolved enormously. MFK Fisher, I frankly find unreadable: her passionless droning is like being stuck on a bus next to somebody's grandmother. My hero Liebling was at his best writing about boxing and politics. Too many great gastronomes, from Brillat Savarin to Liebling to Jim Harrison, have a self-satisfied swagger that I find unattractive, not least because I have been guilty of it myself. To me, the best writing about food I know has been in the last few years: Tom Junod's pieces in Esquire; Alan Richman and Jeff Steingarten's work in GQ and Vogue; Kenny Shopsin's Eat Me, the most honest book I've ever read about food; Oliver Strand's work on coffee; and so on. I think that Adam Platt and Frank Bruni wrote the best restaurant criticism, purely in terms of prose, that anyone has done. Just compare Bruni's prose with Craig Claiborne or Ruth Reichl; it's like night and day. But "food writing" won't really reach its maturity until it becomes simply writing, and is no longer primarily aimed at instructing home cooks or hipping trendy foodies to the last hot spot.

You've written your fair share of clever and notably controversial columns. Which ones have sparked the greatest debates? Do you regret anything you have written, eaten or done?
I had hoped that my recent piece in Gastronomica would be more polarizing than it was; I put a lot into it, and there was a dark, Swiftian element that I thought more people would miss. I liked debating with Mark Bittman about the value of chain restaurants earlier this year. My position on meat-eating, which is more nuanced than I am generally given credit for, is an ongoing subject of debate with vegetarians. I regret most meals, many actions, and more than a few pieces of writing. Much of my stuff was written in haste, and regretted a long time indeed.

You recently mentioned in your Time column that you've taken to intermittent fasting instead of committing to a diet to lose weight. How's that going for you?  Do you think that's really a wise idea considering you're a food writer? (Just sayin'.)
How fat do you want me to be, Danyelle? I can't diet. I like food too much to eat salad. Like Johnson, I can be abstemious but not moderate. I know it's not a wise idea. But it works. And that's really all that matters. I'm still too fat. I want to take diet pills, like the ones they gave Judy Garland. Although apparently there is a shortage of them now, I'm told.

Have you gotten any feedback from chefs and restaurant owners about the "Diners' Rights" column you wrote last June? How did they respond?
Many responded, both in print and privately, and overwhelmingly they were against it. But not a single diner wrote in to say a word against it. It really didn't demand much for the diner. I wish it would be reprinted on all place mats, the way the passengers' rights are put in taxicabs.

What can we expect from Meatopia 2012? Have you started planning it yet?
Not only have I started planning it, but it's almost all laid out! It's going to be on September 8 on Randall's Island, on a huge green field next to the river. You can take a boat there or drive, or take the bus. I'm going to have more food, another whole 900 pound steer, more music, and just a cooler experience all around. I'm bringing back the core of Team Meatopia: Seamus Mullen, Michael Psilakis, the LaFriedas, and so forth, but I'm trying to make this year a platform for a global super group of meat chefs: Adam Perry Lang, John Besh, the Joe Beef guys from Montreal, and more. I'm even talking to the Hong Kong Tourism Board about getting a Chinese char siu master to do Cantonese barbecue. It's really somewhat surreal, but we are almost there.  I am trying to do Meatopias in Texas, LA, and Portland, too. I am so into Meatopia.

As a meat, and even more specifically, a burger authority, what do you think is the best burger in New York right now?  And just as importantly, which ones have fallen from grace of late?  We'd also like to pick your brain on your favorite bbq joint and one that's fallen from grace.  (Much obliged!)
I have to say that I was blown away by the Fatty Johnson burger. The flavors, the looseness, the luxury of it it are simply extraordinary. And we've seen, for the first time ever, some really definitive classical, no-frills, orthodox hamburgers of the kind I so admire, thanks to the debut of Steak n Shake and Smashburger. Burger Club in Astoria is really, really good; nobody knows about it but it's awesome. The new Schnippers on 23rd street is wonderful. So those five are the best additions. None of the major burgers have gotten worse: The Little Owl, The Spotted Pig, Txikito, Minetta Tavern -- they're all still great.
As for BBQ, Blue Smoke has gotten better, and both RUB and Hill Country are still at the top of their form. Wildwood is one of the best commercial barbecue restaurants in the country, and I am not just saying that because I'm friends with Steve [Hanson].  Those four are the best, in my professional opinion. Fatty Cue has not been the same, BBQ-wise, since they moved to the West Village, I'm afraid. BBQ needs to be cooked on-site and served fresh; a lot of their stuff is reheated, and while it's still good it's just not the same.

What's your favorite restaurant in your neighborhood?
I have three favorite restaurants in my home base of Alphabet City. Number one is Hearth, criminally underrated, especially by Mr. Adam Platt. I would put Marco's pastas up against anybody's. I like Barbone, on Avenue B, for the baby chicken, the wine, and the eggplant parmigiana. His pastas are first-class too. And then for pizza, I will take Federico's work at Gnocco over Motorino, Keste, or anybody else you can name.

Do you ever cook at home?
I cook at home two or three nights a week, and chronicle the ups and downs of it in my cooking column at Rachael Ray.com. If you want to emulate my oafish-yet-masterful efforts, check out my videos on Ehow Food.

What dining trend do you wish would just die already?
There's a lot of mediocre salumi and charcuterie programs out there. I love the great ones, like Bar Boulud or Il Buco Alimentaria e Vinerio, but some of the other ones are strictly from hunger. I'm also sick of mediocre fried chicken in New York, deep fried and served without any kind of gravy.  Almost none of them are as good as KFC. If only KFC would use good chickens, the world would be a better place.

What dining trends would you like to see more of in New York?
I want someone to do a meat-and-three in New York. I have told Harold Moore this over and over. He's the guy to do it. Him or Robert Newton from Seersucker.  Two proteins, five sides, some biscuits and pudding, and communal seating. Everyone sits down when the want, gets up when they want, eats as much as they want, and everyone pays the same price. This needs to happen, as Bill Simmons says.

Make a case for our readers for why New York is the best restaurant city in the country.
I don't need to make a case. The other cities do it for me. Go find better barbecue in Memphis. Get more great hamburgers in Dallas. Go find a better steak in Chicago. San Francisco has better produce, but who cares about produce? It's like asking who the best hockey player of the 1980s is, or choosing the best looking Kardashian sister.

Is there a new book in the works?
Yes. I have a book coming out in March called "Colonel Sanders and the American Dream." It's a cultural history of the man in the white suit, his chicken and his legacy. It's an interesting story. The book is a small one, more of an extended essay than a history per se, but I think every American should read it. It amazes and depresses me to think that so many Americans think Colonel Sanders was a manufactured icon, like Uncle Ben or somebody.

Where do you see yourself in 10 years?
In my more hopeful moments, I would hope to have a good TV show, a book every two years, and Meatopia events around the world. And to still be married to Danit, and relatively healthy. I would like to have a nice car, a house upstate with a big smoker, and a lot of cash and weapons stowed away in various safe houses both here and abroad.

How do you think food journalism will change 10 years from now?
I think most of the remaining firewalls between writers and chefs will fall away. Even now they're only propped up precariously by a few print establishments. There will be more non-anonymous restaurant critics like you, and food writers who are openly friends with chefs, like me. Transparency and accuracy, rather than an illusory objectivity, will be what writers are judged by, and rightly so.

You're on your deathbed...Sex or dinner?
Sex, always sex. I only became a gastronome because I was a washout as a libertine.